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Thoughts from about a week of playing

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  • Thoughts from about a week of playing

    Hi,

    I've only been playing for about a week. It's still a bit early for me to have concluded all that much about the game but here are a few first thoughts....

    You might want to add the option to watch ads by clicking on something in the main menu. As far as I know, ads are only available after beating an enemy in combat at the moment. I'm least inclined to stop and watch an ad when I'm in the middle of a level. Nor do I want to have to run back round the level to find boxes and click on them at the end. If I had the option to watch ads by, for example, clicking an item in the shop I would be far more likely to do so. You could put on a timer or a daily maximum to limit the number of times people could watch ads.

    The description of the game makes a big thing of saying you'll never have to pay to win. But now you've introduced event packs I'm not sure that that is strictly true. These games can easily devolve into "who is willing to spend the most" and that is not much fun, imo. I understand the need to earn money but you need to think carefully about how you do it. Maybe a compromise would be to get "ad points" each time you watch an ad instead of gems. Ad points could be exchanged for 5 gems each or X ad points could be exchanged for event packs for those who prefer to pay that way.

    ​Otherwise, my main observations relate to getting information about how to play the game. I've mainly used this forum but it's not the easiest thing in the world to navigate. If I understand correctly, I think you have recently made changes to the game which may make old advice on the forum incorrect. It would be helpful to have a sticky saying when changes have been made and what they affect with dates so that you can easily see whether relevent forum advice was given before or after that date.

    Hope this is helpful!

  • #2
    I've only been playing a month and I'd agree with much of what you say, particularly about not having to pay.

    Here's another: it's damned hard, even with the guides and the wiki and all to get real newby info. Mostly what I read on this forum are a) how to grind and get XP so you can reach the infinite high levels or b) how to get the last 0.5 out of the fusion rating of a ring/necklace.

    Honestly! I don't GAF and I'm almost certainly going to move on to another game rather than grinding with XP bonuses and equipment that is tailored to experience. I've learned good stuff on the forum (read about attacking Magroth this morning, e.g.).

    Why isn't there are real newby forum and guides that actually start at the beginning, not cluttered with abbreviations so I have no idea what is being suggested/said?

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by TerryDarc View Post
      Why isn't there are real newby forum and guides that actually start at the beginning, not cluttered with abbreviations so I have no idea what is being suggested/said?
      Would it be helpful if there was a section of the forum dedicated to approved guides? Maybe they could call it "Guides and Walkthroughs"? And if you were to go to that section, maybe they could have a thread for newbies? Maybe call it "General Newb Guide"? Would either of those things be helpful?

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      Newb Guide Link: https://forum.makingfun.com/forum/et...ral-newb-guide
      Last edited by adjacentengels; 02-13-2018, 09:34 PM.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Dance View Post
        ​Otherwise, my main observations relate to getting information about how to play the game. I've mainly used this forum but it's not the easiest thing in the world to navigate. If I understand correctly, I think you have recently made changes to the game which may make old advice on the forum incorrect. It would be helpful to have a sticky saying when changes have been made and what they affect with dates so that you can easily see whether relevent forum advice was given before or after that date.

        Hope this is helpful!
        Thanks for the feedback, yes there have been a number of changes, especially in November 2017 with v1.2.65 that make some parts of the existing information invalid, so please keep that in mind and check the dates of the various guide threads. A sticky would eventually become too big to follow, as it would grow with each new major release of the game.

        All the guides have been written by existing and current forum members, while some are still around and could potentially update them, other are no longer visiting the forums, so those guides cannot be updated directly - a few members have taken up the task of consolidating and updating these thread, but it'll take time, and any assistance would be greatly appreciated as it'll surely help other players as well.



        Originally posted by TerryDarc View Post
        Why isn't there are real newby forum and guides that actually start at the beginning, not cluttered with abbreviations so I have no idea what is being suggested/said?
        If there is anything specific that you have in mind, then ask, or add a request for a guide, and maybe one of the current forum members can provide the answer. As mentioned, the "General Newb Guide" is a great starting place. If there are guides on things you don't care about, you can simply don't read them, they're there for those that want them...
        Jewelry Guide (09 Feb 18 - "Custom Rare Jewelry" usage & "5/4 vs 6/3" rough notes)

        Files: (You don't need Dropbox, select "Direct Download" to download)
        * Base Attributes and Formulae (28 Jan 18 - BH from 1.2.75 have 5% base Parry Chance)
        * Champion Points Distribution "helper" (14 Feb 18 - DPS/Damage with "New" allocations)
        * Jewelry Crafting/Fusing (08 Feb 18 - v1.2.88, no changes found)

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Nhat View Post

          Thanks for the feedback, yes there have been a number of changes, especially in November 2017 with v1.2.65 that make some parts of the existing information invalid, so please keep that in mind and check the dates of the various guide threads. A sticky would eventually become too big to follow, as it would grow with each new major release of the game.

          All the guides have been written by existing and current forum members, while some are still around and could potentially update them, other are no longer visiting the forums, so those guides cannot be updated directly - a few members have taken up the task of consolidating and updating these thread, but it'll take time, and any assistance would be greatly appreciated as it'll surely help other players as well.

          If there is anything specific that you have in mind, then ask, or add a request for a guide, and maybe one of the current forum members can provide the answer. As mentioned, the "General Newb Guide" is a great starting place. If there are guides on things you don't care about, you can simply don't read them, they're there for those that want them...
          I used to write documentation for software and starting from a POV of a new user being pretty much totally ignorant, allows a) users who've done a lot of gaming (not me) to feel good and skip introductions and warm ups and b) gets more newby-newbys into the game. Hard to put yourself in a position of someone who's never gamed, I know. My shooter gaming is pretty much limited to one other MMO.

          I admit I have not read every newby article b/c, for one thing, the new user forum is a bit hard to find, so maybe promoting it up a level? I started off reading a whole bunch of useless (to me) crap about crafting when I wanted to know how to up-level.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by TerryDarc View Post

            I used to write documentation for software and starting from a POV of a new user being pretty much totally ignorant, allows a) users who've done a lot of gaming (not me) to feel good and skip introductions and warm ups and b) gets more newby-newbys into the game. Hard to put yourself in a position of someone who's never gamed, I know. My shooter gaming is pretty much limited to one other MMO.

            I admit I have not read every newby article b/c, for one thing, the new user forum is a bit hard to find, so maybe promoting it up a level? I started off reading a whole bunch of useless (to me) crap about crafting when I wanted to know how to up-level.
            Again, as mentioned, all the guides currently available were written by members of the forum, so any contribution you can make would be appreciated. I can't speak for others, but not everyone have experience in formal documentation writing, and while I can, sort of, write technical docs, the "new user" docs always cause me trouble, how "basic" are you going to go... (I'm a software engineer).

            Sorry that the existing guides are not what you're looking for, they were written by volunteers, hoping to be of some assistance to others. Again, speaking for myself here, and no offence intended, but having your effort being called "useless crap" is a bit disheartening and makes me wonder if it's even worth the time and energy at all, let alone the extra effort required to keep things up to date when changes are made to the game.

            Yes, I know no one's "making" me do it, I decided to write up the guides on my own knowing I'll get no compensation for it, other than the feeling of satisfaction of, hopefully, having been able to at least help someone else in some small way for a game that I enjoy playing. Sorry for the rant, hope you'll be able to appreciate things from my point of view.
            Jewelry Guide (09 Feb 18 - "Custom Rare Jewelry" usage & "5/4 vs 6/3" rough notes)

            Files: (You don't need Dropbox, select "Direct Download" to download)
            * Base Attributes and Formulae (28 Jan 18 - BH from 1.2.75 have 5% base Parry Chance)
            * Champion Points Distribution "helper" (14 Feb 18 - DPS/Damage with "New" allocations)
            * Jewelry Crafting/Fusing (08 Feb 18 - v1.2.88, no changes found)

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Nhat View Post

              Again, as mentioned, all the guides currently available were written by members of the forum, so any contribution you can make would be appreciated. I can't speak for others, but not everyone have experience in formal documentation writing, and while I can, sort of, write technical docs, the "new user" docs always cause me trouble, how "basic" are you going to go... (I'm a software engineer).

              Sorry that the existing guides are not what you're looking for, they were written by volunteers, hoping to be of some assistance to others. Again, speaking for myself here, and no offence intended, but having your effort being called "useless crap" is a bit disheartening and makes me wonder if it's even worth the time and energy at all, let alone the extra effort required to keep things up to date when changes are made to the game.

              Yes, I know no one's "making" me do it, I decided to write up the guides on my own knowing I'll get no compensation for it, other than the feeling of satisfaction of, hopefully, having been able to at least help someone else in some small way for a game that I enjoy playing. Sorry for the rant, hope you'll be able to appreciate things from my point of view.
              I love your jewelry guide, Nhat. Keep making guides excellent. :-)

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Nhat View Post
                having your effort being called "useless crap" is a bit disheartening and makes me wonder if it's even worth the time and energy at all
                It is absolutely worth the time and is overwhelmingly appreciated by everyone playing this game at an intermediate, advanced, or elite level. Your and Coda's (and others') contributions in understanding and documenting the advanced techniques and formulas built into the game are a significant reason that we are now able to optimize so many areas of the game and push so far into Trials, jewelry, etc.


                Originally posted by TerryDarc View Post
                I used to write documentation for software and starting from a POV of a new user being pretty much totally ignorant, allows a) users who've done a lot of gaming (not me) to feel good and skip introductions and warm ups and b) gets more newby-newbys into the game.
                If someone doesn't know how to play a game but skips introductions and warm-ups, what makes you think they are going to read a Newbie Guide? They were given an opportunity to be taught about the game and ignored it. For others, that are interested in learning about the game, the trick is how basic do you make it because the more newbish you assume the audience the more you have to explain but the more you explain the less attainable the knowledge becomes due to the length of the information. The current Newb Guide is very long and honestly you can't digest it in one reading, but it gives you a good overview of the game and as you progress through you start to understand things that you couldn't get at first. Then you read it again after playing and a lot more makes sense. And you keep going back to it as a reference to refine and clarify your understanding. It's great because it is a single resource that explains almost everything about the game except for advanced formula details about optimization. It was my landing spot for these entire forums because I used it more than everything else here combined for my first month, at least, of playing.


                Originally posted by TerryDarc View Post
                I admit I have not read every newby article b/c, for one thing, the new user forum is a bit hard to find, so maybe promoting it up a level? I started off reading a whole bunch of useless (to me) crap about crafting when I wanted to know how to up-level.
                Well, the Guides section is the first subforum listed. The Newb Guide, while it used to be stickied (and I'm not sure why it isn't anymore) is still on the first page of the Guides subforum. If you can't be bothered to even read the titles of the guides to see that there is one directly targeted at newbies then nothing we do will ever bridge that gap.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I re-stuck it.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Nhat , your guides are the best. Your jewelry guide covers the most complex part of this game so thoroughly. {Now I'm wondering if your super-newb guide, with all the pics etc. has been moved to the Guide section yet?}

                    Other guides recently written, perhaps not yet in the Guide Section:

                    - mattks1 basic Guide to Builds
                    - my guide to Speed Run of The Descent

                    The only 'valid point' of the o.p. and the subsequent rant, in my mind, is that certain parts of the guides have not yet been updated since the big updates in the '17 fall/winter.

                    TerryDarc please do move on from this game. You did not take 30 seconds to look through the short guide section? And then post an offensive rant? Buh Bye to you sir.

                    http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-li...rlines/3506436

                    ​​​​​​​
                    VUFO ZEBE ZAQI 1381
                    ~ Gethi, mage, TL109 mobile & TL115 PC
                    ~ Kisheli, XP mage, TL109 PC
                    ~ Ketushi, mage in A New Beginning, TL100

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by adjacentengels View Post
                      having your effort being called "useless crap" is a bit disheartening and makes me wonder if it's even worth the time and energy at all
                      First, that is a misquote: I SAID as a newby, fresh off the street player, that learning to craft that last .5% was, to me, "useless crap". It is and it was. I stick by what I said. The crafting/grinding people have every right to be here and hone their efforts. It's just that that stuff gets in the road of someone who wanders in off the street like me.

                      That said, I have read a lot. A LOT on the forums and I much appreciate what Nhat and Mattsk1 and many, many others have done. Amazing amount of patience and work to put that info together. It just DOESN'T get a new user over the hump and into playing. I suggested moving the newby forum out of Playing Guides Section. I stick with that. Took me quite a bit of time to find it and now read there often.

                      Great Eternium player community but any complicated system (Eternium included) can use critique. I also like the way developers/mgrs. come here to post. I love how dedicated users have gone to great lengths to post guides, respond, etc. Good info, don't take me wrong, please.

                      Well, the Guides section is the first subforum listed. The Newb Guide, while it used to be stickied (and I'm not sure why it isn't anymore) is still on the first page of the Guides subforum. If you can't be bothered to even read the titles of the guides to see that there is one directly targeted at newbies then nothing we do will ever bridge that gap.
                      I'll just relate my honest effort to find info took a couple weeks of digging. May be obvious to you but you may need fresh eyes to see why it may not be to a new user and I can tell you that new users are the lifeblood of this game. Peace.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by TerryDarc View Post
                        I'll just relate my honest effort to find info took a couple weeks of digging.
                        I was a brand new user not too long ago. I came to the forums before I was level 10 in-game on my first character. I was reading the newbie guide within 10 minutes of being on the forum.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by TerryDarc View Post
                          First, that is a misquote: I SAID as a newby, fresh off the street player, that learning to craft that last .5% was, to me, "useless crap". It is and it was. I stick by what I said. The crafting/grinding people have every right to be here and hone their efforts. It's just that that stuff gets in the road of someone who wanders in off the street like me.
                          I saw that in your post; from my view, there's a difference between "meh, I don't care about this stuff" and "this is useless crap" - minor wording, however the second conveys a much more negative feeling (to me anyway). Appreciate you taking the time to clarify, thank you.

                          Out of curiosity, did you end up finding anything to help with what you were after?


                          Coda - it's the Unlocking Game Features thread and yes, it have been moved by Travis (thanks)
                          Jewelry Guide (09 Feb 18 - "Custom Rare Jewelry" usage & "5/4 vs 6/3" rough notes)

                          Files: (You don't need Dropbox, select "Direct Download" to download)
                          * Base Attributes and Formulae (28 Jan 18 - BH from 1.2.75 have 5% base Parry Chance)
                          * Champion Points Distribution "helper" (14 Feb 18 - DPS/Damage with "New" allocations)
                          * Jewelry Crafting/Fusing (08 Feb 18 - v1.2.88, no changes found)

                          Comment

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