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  • Kardinaal
    replied
    the free stat slot you mentioned allows you to put say 8000 power with lily vs 5000 with crit, and at the same time more haste, ar and defensive stats

    And there is the problem with Lilly. Yes you can add more power, ar,… but those higher numbers are all affected by diminishing returns.

    On a crit build you divide your stat points into more cathergories. So the build as a whole will have less diminishing returns.

    As you said, my shield warrior hardly notices top going off. A power boost from 15k to 20k power is noticeable, but not to the point it’s worth saving skills to burst during the proc. I might be better off with a charm of qol and cleave/frenzy or even a vial of the wind spirit (also for more attack speed on cleave). There is a good chance the extra damage from a faster cleave outperforms top.



    And also, some builds don’t work with fire lilly due to needing crit to work, like bleed warriors for example.
    Last edited by Kardinaal; 11-17-2021, 11:18 AM. Reason: Typo

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  • bojck
    replied
    Well this is a good starting point, but there are a lot of other factors:
    - the free stat slot you mentioned allows you to put say 8000 power with lily vs 5000 with crit, and at the same time more haste, ar and defensive stats
    - if you have 8000 power, ToP's 5000 additional power is not that great
    - ToP and ToS affect skills slightly differently and need different timing (especially regarding thermal shock after frostbeam)
    - lily damage is lower but constant, crit damage is spiky. This means that:
    - with crit sometimes a lot of the damage is lost due to overkills
    - with lily it's harder to kill an enemy with a single beam + nova, which gives them time to get healed

    The list goes on...

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  • LodWig
    replied
    You are almost right for the comparison of Lily and crit builds. With the latter you will do CD% damage with CC% chance, and 100% damage with (1-CC%) chance. The average factor is thus (1 + CC% x (CD% - 1)) after simplification.
    With 35% CC and 1800% CD you get 695%, with 28% CC and 1600% CD you get 520%. Both are winning against the Lily.

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  • Neponde
    commented on 's reply
    Ah thats what that little nugget means

  • Turgeon
    replied
    Talisman share 8nternal cooldown its why everyone only use one talisman

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  • Neponde
    started a topic Trinket Talk

    Trinket Talk

    Alright,

    i understand that a crit build will let you push further than fire lily, though lily certainly seems to carry the day for leveling and xp farming.

    Mathematically, it seems to make sense that the lily will outpace the crit build as long as your CR x CD < 500%? Eg, if my CR is 35%, and my CD is 1800 than CRxCD =630%, making it stronger, but a Cd of 1600 and cr of 28% means a total of about 450%, making the lily superior? (Not to mention the availability of another stat slot). Unless there is some obscure in game formula I'm missing?

    secondly, why do bh and mage typically run talisman of storms and vial of wind? Why not replace the wind with the talisman of power? Thinking frostfire for a moment, either the 2 talismans will stack on a beam and make it truly gnarly, or you can get twice as many super-beams on the poor unsuspecting Kara?

    signed,
    A brand newbie.
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