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Charm of Qol / Versatile Belt w/ FB/AL

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    Charm of Qol / Versatile Belt w/ FB/AL

    I did some testing and thought I'd share the result.

    Neither the Charm of Qol nor the Versatile Belt increase DPS on their own - it appears that the secondary attack takes place instead of the primary attack, so with the versatile belt, even 6th attack is the secondary instead of the primary, and for the Charm of Qol, this varies depending on Haste and other factors, but the primary attack is replaced by the secondary attack every 1.2 seconds at most (slightly more in practice, depending on haste).

    I was hoping the secondary attack would be a freebie, activating independently, but this does not appear to be the case. Using Arcane bolts, fireball or Frostbolt as the secondary has no major impact on DPS against a single foe, though Fireball does add a little bit to multiple foes because of the AoE.

    However, if Arc Lightning is the secondary, you are assured of a continuous +5% attack speed, and the enemies will take +5% damage, without having to switch attacks manually (with the added bonus of an additional slight multiple enemy effect when it jumps). This works for me, since I never remember to double press for the secondary attack (mobile user). It's a lazy way to add the effect of AL without having to remember to use it every once in awhile.

    I detected no appreciable difference between the Charm of Qol and the Versatile Belt - with AL as the secondary, both increased DPS from 65% to 46% (depending on haste, more attacks per second decreased the effect on DPS). For low level characters with a slow attack speed, the increase would be impressive and for high level characters with a high attack speed the increase is still significant. This is expected because the faster the mage's attack speed, the more attacks per second are being converted to a lower direct damage secondary attack - the real effect doesn't come from direct damage but from any buff/debuff caused by the secondary attack.

    Using both the Charm of Qol and the Versatile Belt together improved DPS over using neither of them, but the effect was less than using one or the other. This is expected because it is replacing more of the primary attacks (in my case, Frostbolt is my preferred) with a secondary attack that does less direct damage (in my primary case of FB/AL).

    Just thought I'd share the testing results - I hope they help you out a little bit.

    #2
    (Hunter speaking here.) What you said is not true for the QoL. It does increase the a/s. Will test the Versatile.
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      #3
      Originally posted by LodWig View Post
      (Hunter speaking here.) What you said is not true for the QoL. It does increase the a/s. Will test the Versatile.
      I might certainly be wrong - I am only going by DPS numbers with different combinations of primary/secondary abilities. I don't see a way to accurately find my real attacks/second value - the value shown in the Hero Attributes section only seems to take Haste into account, and not Endar's aura or anything else. And on the details tab in the testing area, it only shows the attack number for my primary attack - I could use a stopwatch and time how many primary attacks I get over a minute and divide to get a relatively accurate number, but since the number doesn't account for the secondary attack I'm not sure how useful that would be.

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      • LodWig
        LodWig commented
        Editing a comment
        Well it seems we are both right and wrong... With QoL equipped, I see a bit less of primary attacks, but more attacks overall: with low haste, and in two minutes TG tests, i got 490 primary attacks without QoL, and 465 primary plus 102 secondary attacks with QoL (no Haste on the QoL).

        So the QoL is indeed triggered with a close to 50ppm rate, but the attack speed is not increased by 5/6 a/s (about 83/100), in this particular setup I got only 77/120 more a/s (about 64/100). In other words, the expected relative increase is 100/490 = 20.4%, but was only 77/490 = 15.7%.

        The triggered secondary slow down the primary, but does not entirely replace it.

        All tests were done with a Fire Lily equipped but no weapons. This way there is no variations in damage done (as long as the power isn't changed). The number of secondary attacks from QoL can then be computed from the total damage and the previously measured average damage of the attack (or, if you know the exact power value, the computed damage).

        (Beware, there is a weird bug that can affect your results with the QoL.)
        Last edited by LodWig; 07-14-2020, 03:53 PM.

      • LodWig
        LodWig commented
        Editing a comment
        With the same setup, using a Versatile without Haste nor Power, I got 466 primary plus 93 secondary attack. (as expected, 93*5=465), and using both the QoL and the Versatile, 448 primary plus 180 secondary attacks (a little bit less than expected, 100 from QoL and 90 from the belt).

        Summary table:

        Primary Secondary Total a/s Ratio
        Nothing 490 490 4,083 100%
        QoL 465 102 567 4,725 116%
        Versatile 466 93 559 4,658 114%
        Both 448 180 628 5,233 128%
        (Take the a/s and ratio with a grain of salt, the QoL proc is per minute.)
        Last edited by LodWig; 07-14-2020, 04:22 PM.

      • Citizen055
        Citizen055 commented
        Editing a comment
        Thanks LodWig... that is some good testing, and also some good ideas for testing methods (no weapon - it should have occurred to me but didn't). I wish I could find a fire lily - around 100 TL85 runs and haven't found one yet.

      #4
      I mainly use QoL for because of the AL buff/debuff. If I can get a Versatile Belt, I'd replace my QoL with some other trinket. Once every 6 attack is more than enough to keep AL buff at max for the entire trial run. The damage from my 2nd attack doesn't matter, it sometimes doesn't even show up on the Stat sheets. Same for the Warrior, I want the attack speed bonus of my 2nd attack.

      Frankly, I don't see much use for QoL/Versatile Belt on a Hunter.

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      • Ozymandius
        Ozymandius commented
        Editing a comment
        I would say, yes if you are looking for a big boost in your BH then Charm of Qol would not be the answer. What it does for my Demolitionist BH is add in a few extra Lethal Shot attacks, which are then buffed up by a Bracer of Mastery that increases Lethal Shot damage. Even then, the extra secondary attacks only amount to only about 6-8% of overall damage in trials. But so far, I have not found another trinket or talisman that matches that extra bit of damage.

        Talisman of Storms is my primary trinket on BH, but I have also tried Talisman of the Pyromaniac, Brooch of Purifying Flames (currently on ELR Mage), Talisman of Doom (currently on old Jugg Warrior), Talisman of Power (currently on a Fury hybrid Warrior), Talisman of Nature's Fury, and Brooch of Stormcaller (currently on gold farmer).

      #5
      Originally posted by mousse View Post
      I mainly use QoL for because of the AL buff/debuff. If I can get a Versatile Belt, I'd replace my QoL with some other trinket. Once every 6 attack is more than enough to keep AL buff at max for the entire trial run. The damage from my 2nd attack doesn't matter, it sometimes doesn't even show up on the Stat sheets. Same for the Warrior, I want the attack speed bonus of my 2nd attack.

      Frankly, I don't see much use for QoL/Versatile Belt on a Hunter.
      Same here. Between Qol and VB, I like Qol better (and LodWig's testing indicates it is indeed slightly better). However, there are no belts other than the VB that will be of use to my mage, and there are certainly other trinkets that I would use, so that will make the VB my default belt - hence why it is the only new thing I have unlocked so far.

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      • LodWig
        LodWig commented
        Editing a comment
        (and LodWig's testing indicates it is indeed slightly better)
        In this case, but probably not with higher attack speed: In theory, QoL is 50ppm (5/6 a/s), Versatile is 20% of your a/s.
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